Measures 1.3.0 Beta 1 (Last test hopefully.

[hkphantomgtr]

6. Yet Roon bridge can't be installed thru Snakeoil software menu, it needs the "Roon Bridge (armv8)"   in here, so I ran following line, then bridge is installed easily and successfully.
 

Code:

bash -c "$(wget -qLO - https://download.roonlabs.net/builds/roonbridge-installer-linuxarmv8.sh)"

Whoop! I forgot that Snakeoil Pi is 64 bits now. Will need to update and download the 64 bit build. Even though 64 bit OS can technically run 32 bit applications, I'm pretty sure the stock image will not include the 32 bit toolchain to run 'em. Creating a ticket to fix this for 1.3.0 official. Hope to still do so this weekend. Thanks.

During installation, I rebooted several times to complete all the installations.  So far this beta didn't cause me any trouble.

That is strange. And what stage? I don't recall needing to do this, just need to reboot once.

Yet it's pity that even I've enabled the RT kernel (pro enable realtime-kernel) successfully, and in SO menu can select it (and saved), all the time Pi only boots the ordinary kernel.  Being a new Pi user, I'm quite disappointed for this, towards Ubuntu.  Furthermore, it doesn't have my favorite hpet clocksource.  I'll try this again when the SO official release come, then I'll fresh-install everything.  I'll do the RT patching before installing SO.  Fingers crossed.

This will be addressed in a later versions of Measurements. For now you should be able to update boot.txt to choose a kernel.

I don't believe Pi will have HPET clocksource. In fact I'm not sure it even have a hardware clock (Different to a real time clock). It may be possible to link a Pi to a hardware clock via GPIO? Do you or anybody have any details on this? Or possibly a CM4/CM5 module to an expansion board with a hardware clock.

And for the sound, I hope it would be better in the official release.

Probably not. Improvements will have to come from kernel tweaks, physical mods and so on.

For the reboot, I'm sorry that I misled here.  I mean together with the ubuntu os installation, update and etc, not only SO installation.

And for the kernel to boot, definitely I'll follow your direction.  Previously I've tried some method from internet but got no luck.

And for the clock, Thanks for your info, well.... that's far beyond my knowledge to discuss about....... haha

[Snoopy8]

With Ubuntu Server 22.0.04 LTS, all versions of Mpd are working as expected.  No stray install of MPD (dsd-018).  And all libraries loaded properly.  However, with implications for 1.3.1, cannot create loopback for CamillaDSP
 sudo modprobe snd-aloop
modprobe:  FATAL: Module snd-aloop not found in directory /lib/modules/5.15.0-1034-raspi

If only I have that kernel build site up and running. This can only be solved by building your own kernel. I believe you have done this before?

While I have built a kernel, most people will not be able to do this.  Maybe the better long term OS & Kernel going forward for Pi is Bookworm and Ubuntu should be dropped for Pi ???

[uglymusic]

But Ubuntu 23.10 64-bit Server still returns:

Need to say AMD/Intel or Pi now.. As they are all 64 bits.

This 23.10 issue I can only solve later in the next year. Unfortunately very much overwhelmed with work right now I just don't have any spare capacity after work.

Touch base with me on this next year as I will definitely forget this by then. However next year 24.02 LTS will be released, and that'll make 23.10 moot.

Yep. No worries. I'll use the Pi 5 for something else in the meantime.

---

So, it looks as if it's my turn to own up to a FU.

In amongst trying to test Alpha and Beta SO, Raspberry Pi OS and Ubuntus LTS and 23.10, RPi 4 and RPi 5 servers, and RPi 3 and RPi 4 clients, I got my SD cards muddled up.

What I thought was a fully functioning RPi 3 client machine running Alpha 2, was in fact, running SO 1.2.X, not 1.3. I discovered this when I went to upgrade from Alpha to Beta.

Now upgraded, I cannot get the HAT to work. I don't have time to chase down precisely what is happening until the weekend. 

Sorry for the muddle and and failing to notice I wasn't running 1.3.

This makes me smile.. Thanks...

Microsd cards. They're tiny, and I/O isn't particularly good on Pi3 and Pi4.. I think the newer Pi5 have better throughput but I can't remember the acronyms to be sure. BTW, I believe you can boot the OS directly off a USB now with a firmware update (works for pi 4) too. So that might be a better option. But I have yet to try it.

I'm glad I made you smile!

You can boot from a USB drive on a 4 or 5, but I haven't had the enthusiasm to actually try it. I have a spare small SSD somewhere. And, as I think I've said before here (definitely somewhere!), my RPi server eats microSD cards! I now use heavy-duty SanDisk ones for surveillance cameras.

---

With Ubuntu Server 22.0.04 LTS, all versions of Mpd are working as expected.  No stray install of MPD (dsd-018).  And all libraries loaded properly.  However, with implications for 1.3.1, cannot create loopback for CamillaDSP
 sudo modprobe snd-aloop
modprobe:  FATAL: Module snd-aloop not found in directory /lib/modules/5.15.0-1034-raspi

If only I have that kernel build site up and running. This can only be solved by building your own kernel. I believe you have done this before?

While I have built a kernel, most people will not be able to do this.  Maybe the better long term OS & Kernel going forward for Pi is Bookworm and Ubuntu should be dropped for Pi ???

I don't have a clue how to build a kernel!

If I understand correctly, Ubuntu gives the opportunity to swap kernels, but Raspberry Pi OS doesn't. Is that right? If that's the case, I'd like to have Ubuntu, even if it means waiting for the LTS early next year.

[Snoopy8]

Finally did some listening comparisons:

• NUC running 1.2.13 (Gear Isolation U13) on Ubuntu 22.04.1 LTS with 5.15.01032-realtime kernel, Mpd 23.12
  
• Mercury (Pi CM4) running 1.3.0.1 (Measurements U0 BETA) on Debian GNU/Linux 12 (bookworm) with 6.1.0-rpi7-rpi-v8 kernel, Mpd 23.5
  

Both running same convolution filters in CamillaDSP, same dual power supply, same USB cable.  The NUC was cleaner, with more detail than the Mercury.  I changed the NUC to the standard 5.15.0-89-generic kernel which reduced the difference, but NUC is marginally better.

I suspect the difference is due to the time I have put into the NUC, e.g Bios and hardware tweaks, compared with Mercury which is my first Pi.  Note the difference is apparent only when comparing side by side.

[uglymusic]

RPi 3 and 4 clients with Raspberry Pi OS 64-bit Lite or Ubuntu LTS 64-bit server are working with their respective HATs and SO Beta 1 (Squeezelite 1.6.4 and Ralph 2).

Beta 1 has been running all day, every day, on the RPi 4 server with Ubuntu LTS.

It all sounds good in the office. I haven't yet tried 1.3 on my big rig. 

The RPi 5 is sidelined for the moment.

[agent_kith]

While I have built a kernel, most people will not be able to do this.  Maybe the better long term OS & Kernel going forward for Pi is Bookworm and Ubuntu should be dropped for Pi ???

Pi only has Ubuntu and Bookworm. Dropping both will essentially drop Pi completely. That's not going to happen for now. Progress on Snakeoil is slow, but progress on Pi (hardware development) is even slower.

Pi 2 and 3 plainly sucks to be honest, with Pi 4 it's just getting better. And Pi 5 might be even better. Lack of a hardware clock is a downer, but on the other hand, a hardware clock is a potential for system noise. <- Ignore this theory because almost every audio hardware has a hardware clock so I'm just being silly.

Good thing with the Pi is the hardware is all the same (ignoring HATs).. If using a USB DAC (like I am going to do), the kernel I compile and use will be applicable to everybody else who uses a USB DAC. Same theory applies to the ZIMA board. Bottom line is a common hardware.

Unfortunately both hardware are kind of hard to buy at the moment. But maybe next year we'll get easier access.

[agent_kith]

I suspect the difference is due to the time I have put into the NUC, e.g Bios and hardware tweaks, compared with Mercury which is my first Pi.  Note the difference is apparent only when comparing side by side.

What power source do you use with the Mercury?

Mercury, if you see this shoot me a DM (which you can't because this is a private section of the forum) . lol..

[Snoopy8]

I suspect the difference is due to the time I have put into the NUC, e.g Bios and hardware tweaks, compared with Mercury which is my first Pi.  Note the difference is apparent only when comparing side by side.

What power source do you use with the Mercury?

Mercury, if you see this shoot me a DM (which you can't because this is a private section of the forum) . lol..

Both are powered by a Gieseler Kraftwerk II Dual power supply. 

Note that this small difference should not be the cause of alarm. Given that Intel no longer makes the NUC, with third parties taking over, I am more likely to go Pi 5 when the NUC gives up.  Hence the stumbling steps with the Pi now...

[hkphantomgtr]

6. Yet Roon bridge can't be installed thru Snakeoil software menu, it needs the "Roon Bridge (armv8)"   in here, so I ran following line, then bridge is installed easily and successfully.
 

Code:

bash -c "$(wget -qLO - https://download.roonlabs.net/builds/roonbridge-installer-linuxarmv8.sh)"

Whoop! I forgot that Snakeoil Pi is 64 bits now. Will need to update and download the 64 bit build. Even though 64 bit OS can technically run 32 bit applications, I'm pretty sure the stock image will not include the 32 bit toolchain to run 'em. Creating a ticket to fix this for 1.3.0 official. Hope to still do so this weekend. Thanks.

During installation, I rebooted several times to complete all the installations.  So far this beta didn't cause me any trouble.

That is strange. And what stage? I don't recall needing to do this, just need to reboot once.

Yet it's pity that even I've enabled the RT kernel (pro enable realtime-kernel) successfully, and in SO menu can select it (and saved), all the time Pi only boots the ordinary kernel.  Being a new Pi user, I'm quite disappointed for this, towards Ubuntu.  Furthermore, it doesn't have my favorite hpet clocksource.  I'll try this again when the SO official release come, then I'll fresh-install everything.  I'll do the RT patching before installing SO.  Fingers crossed.

This will be addressed in a later versions of Measurements. For now you should be able to update boot.txt to choose a kernel.

I don't believe Pi will have HPET clocksource. In fact I'm not sure it even have a hardware clock (Different to a real time clock). It may be possible to link a Pi to a hardware clock via GPIO? Do you or anybody have any details on this? Or possibly a CM4/CM5 module to an expansion board with a hardware clock.

And for the sound, I hope it would be better in the official release.

Probably not. Improvements will have to come from kernel tweaks, physical mods and so on.

For the reboot, I'm sorry that I misled here.  I mean together with the ubuntu os installation, update and etc, not only SO installation.

And for the kernel to boot, definitely I'll follow your direction.  Previously I've tried some method from internet but got no luck.

And for the clock, Thanks for your info, well.... that's far beyond my knowledge to discuss about....... haha

Hi, AK,

I've googled for booting with desired kernel and modified the symlink.  But, I still can't boot into the desired kernel.  Would you please tell me how to do it when you're free?  Thanks a lot.

[uglymusic]

I suspect the difference is due to the time I have put into the NUC, e.g Bios and hardware tweaks, compared with Mercury which is my first Pi.  Note the difference is apparent only when comparing side by side.

What power source do you use with the Mercury?

Mercury, if you see this shoot me a DM (which you can't because this is a private section of the forum) . lol..

Both are powered by a Gieseler Kraftwerk II Dual power supply. 

Note that this small difference should not be the cause of alarm. Given that Intel no longer makes the NUC, with third parties taking over, I am more likely to go Pi 5 when the NUC gives up.  Hence the stumbling steps with the Pi now...

So, the PSU is around 10x the price of a Pi 5 (I'm not sure if Google is giving me US$ or AU$). Wow!

---

While I have built a kernel, most people will not be able to do this.  Maybe the better long term OS & Kernel going forward for Pi is Bookworm and Ubuntu should be dropped for Pi ???

Pi only has Ubuntu and Bookworm. Dropping both will essentially drop Pi completely. That's not going to happen for now. Progress on Snakeoil is slow, but progress on Pi (hardware development) is even slower.

Pi 2 and 3 plainly sucks to be honest, with Pi 4 it's just getting better. And Pi 5 might be even better. Lack of a hardware clock is a downer, but on the other hand, a hardware clock is a potential for system noise. <- Ignore this theory because almost every audio hardware has a hardware clock so I'm just being silly.

Good thing with the Pi is the hardware is all the same (ignoring HATs).. If using a USB DAC (like I am going to do), the kernel I compile and use will be applicable to everybody else who uses a USB DAC. Same theory applies to the ZIMA board. Bottom line is a common hardware.

Unfortunately both hardware are kind of hard to buy at the moment. But maybe next year we'll get easier access.

Sorry if I'm repeating myself, but my experience is that RPi 3 and 4 sound very much the same via HATs (I don't have two of the same for A/B testing, if that's our kind of thing, nor do I have an RPi 2). Raw USB is so far behind any HAT I've tried that I never think of USB as an option. But I'd be tempted to see if any of the other options for digital output on the RPi 5 are worthwhile. 

Still apologising for my total lack of knowledge about the kernel and customising it; are you saying that each HAT needs its own variation on the kernel? I know I'm misunderstanding you because I have four different HATs running - two DACs and two SPDIFs - without kernel modification.

I feel a lot of Linux-related reading coming on.